Congrats to Slamin Sammy Sosa (600 HR club)

[AzElvis]

I mean we post about Gordon havin a kid which is totally sports related. Yet a feet that puts him with Mays, Ruth, Bonds, Mantle etc and we can't mention? IMO he has never failed a test and #s speak for themselves. We hear of Mantle, Mays etc. taking amphetamines which if anyone knows anything is a lot more performance enhancing then steroids or most other drugs. We can't go back and test etc. I say #s are #s and let baseball decide to make tests tougher but until then he should be a first ballot HOFer. IMO Anyone think NOT? Let's hear it.

[jeremy_r_tuttle]

Originally Posted by AzElvis

I mean we post about Gordon havin a kid which is totally sports related. Yet a feet that puts him with Mays, Ruth, Bonds, Mantle etc and we can't mention? IMO he has never failed a test and #s speak for themselves. We hear of Mantle, Mays etc. taking amphetamines which if anyone knows anything is a lot more performance enhancing then steroids or most other drugs. We can't go back and test etc. I say #s are #s and let baseball decide to make tests tougher but until then he should be a first ballot HOFer. IMO Anyone think NOT? Let's hear it.

Are we ignoring the corked bat? Or how about the fact that he took a hiatus from baseball for awhile and comes back looking obviously smaller in a time when all the talk was steriods?

[islandgirl]

I do take issue with juiced up players being placed in the same catagory as say, Willie Mays.

Having said that thought, I don't sit there and shake my fist at the tv when I see Bonds et al come to bat. Until I have 100% definitive proof, I'll simply rub my chin and shake my head at what I percieve to have happened. I mean, it's pretty obvious that these guys are a lot smaller than they were a couple of years ago in their hayday...

To me, the sad thing is that these players actually are quite talented and it's too bad that we will never truly know what they could have done if they had played au naturel.

[parrotheadduff]

Another cheater.

[ocho cinco]

Sosa is a proven cheater... unlike Bonds... but we all know Bonds was a cheater...

[ibzilly]

anyone that has been brought to court over a Steroid scandal has a cloud over them. Barry, Sosa, McGwire and Raffy in my opinion dont deserve to be aloud in the HOF. I dont care what there numbers show. In my opinion they used roids. You look at all these guys the year before there numbers bloomed look how much they weighed before/after. Gaining 30lbs from 190lbs is NUTS. Also another guy that has been forgotten. Brady Anderson. Where did he go. 50hrs one year and vanished. HMMM. Come on people. I think putting these guys into the HOF is sickening. And I hope Barry breaks his leg before he gets that record. I cant stand the guy. Taking a legit HOF record and tarnishing it with a Roid user is just.... cant say it on the boards. No matter anyways. There are younger talents going to break the record anyway. A-Rod or Miguel Cabera or Pujols one will get it.
So to answer your post Troy. NOOO PROPS.

[AzElvis]

Cabrera? Maybe ship Griffey or Arod to Coors Field. Fast track. How many pitchers on the juice? Funny how Gagne disappeared? Matter of fact a bunch are gone. Liriano? WHere did he go? Just askin O dont jump me. We may need to re-visit stat leaders who suddenly vanished. I get where you're coming from and appreciate your opinion.

[SiteWolf]

Originally Posted by AzElvis

Liriano? WHere did he go?

Tommy John surgery

[StormJr]

Originally Posted by AzElvis

Funny how Gagne disappeared?

surgery for him as well a few years back and has been periodically injured since.

[jeremy_r_tuttle]

Originally Posted by AzElvis

Liriano? WHere did he go? We may need to re-visit stat leaders who suddenly vanished.

What stat was Liriano leading?

[jeremy_r_tuttle]

Originally Posted by ibzilly

I dont care what there numbers show. In my opinion they used roids. You look at all these guys the year before there numbers bloomed look how much they weighed before/after. Gaining 30lbs from 190lbs is NUTS.

In retrospect, when I got out of high school I was 210. After my first year at college I was 215. Second year I found the weight room and went to 235 and I guarantee you my workout regimen was nothing compared to some of these athletes. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying 30lb weight gain isn't something that is usual.

[blastingoff]

30 LBs for lifting weight for a 190 guy is VERY possible and not uncommon at all. I gained nearly 40 when I started lifting when I was 20. I started at 180 wound up at 218 in 2 years time. So, to me, their change of muscle and body shape mean nothing as far as I am concerned.

[parrotheadduff]

Originally Posted by blastingoff

30 LBs for lifting weight for a 190 guy is VERY possible and not uncommon at all. I gained nearly 40 when I started lifting when I was 20. I started at 180 wound up at 218 in 2 years time. So, to me, their change of muscle and body shape mean nothing as far as I am concerned.

What about the squaring of the head and jaw?