The ever popular split conversation

[yon Beast]

baseball doesn't actually start until March 31.

[Blackhawkaholic]

Why penalize those that have endured the ups & downs of holding splits???? If as was said in the beginning of the site that we are trying to mimic a 'Sports Stock Exchange' then let them ride, sports are not a level playing field, if someone joined last year, much like if i bought a stock, do they deserve the same benefits & immediate (when they have enough $$$ to own the same number of shares as someone who has been here for years?) ability to buy what it took me years to earn? Stop taking away the million plus shares, none of us need more cash, if i want to lose 18% OF 10 million shares worth, isnt that my perogative, just think of how much cash I would have lost when Mo Rivera went down to injury last spring on the sell off of his stock. If it's not broke dont fix it. Why penalize those of us who have been here long term & check in everyday but dont day trade??? I see the point in letting people day trade 100k but why not find other ways of SPENDING the $$$ you create in the sell off, that would liven up the markets instead of making more cash that we can never expect to spend, OR give us the option of keeping our millions of splits & reaping the + & - of holding onto them.

[rrock33]

keep the current split trading thru March.

[SiteWolf]

Originally Posted by Blackhawkaholic

Why penalize those that have endured the ups & downs of holding splits???? If as was said in the beginning of the site that we are trying to mimic a 'Sports Stock Exchange' then let them ride, sports are not a level playing field, if someone joined last year, much like if i bought a stock, do they deserve the same benefits & immediate (when they have enough $$$ to own the same number of shares as someone who has been here for years?) ability to buy what it took me years to earn? Stop taking away the million plus shares, none of us need more cash, if i want to lose 18% OF 10 million shares worth, isnt that my perogative, just think of how much cash I would have lost when Mo Rivera went down to injury last spring on the sell off of his stock. If it's not broke dont fix it. Why penalize those of us who have been here long term & check in everyday but dont day trade??? I see the point in letting people day trade 100k but why not find other ways of SPENDING the $$$ you create in the sell off, that would liven up the markets instead of making more cash that we can never expect to spend, OR give us the option of keeping our millions of splits & reaping the + & - of holding onto them.

Yours is the type of input I've been wanting to hear more of...because some have thought my penchant was to cater to the inactive when I know there are many like you....not active traders, but still actively logging in regularly.

Believe me, I am NOT wanting to lessen anyone's enjoyment here. The selloffs began for similar reasons amnesties did- so a mistake made today couldn't negatively effect someone forever after.

I know many like splits. We just need to find a way to have 'the best of both worlds' as much as possible- not let the market get stale with stocks not being traded, not unfairly benefit the active trader vs the more casual trader (like I've been worried this 100k trading could), yet still allow people the enjoyment of having splits.

Right now I expect we'd continue what we've been doing, but I'm still hesitant to allow 100k trading for 'daily' players (NBAers/skaters/hitters) out of concern that active traders will blow by casual traders (hence the reason I'd allowed 50k before). Anything else, at this point, would require programming we're not able to get to right now anyway.

Moving forward, understand that if we were to go with something like has been talked about in this thread (a new class of stock created when a stock splits then the 'regular' stock re-IPOd) we'd have the potential of going back in time, if desired...that would use up some of your cash reserves. We've always wanted mutual funds, which would use up another chunk of available cash. I've thought of 'organization' stocks that (just spitballing yet here) would be high dollar/share stocks that would only divi at the end of their season..the divi being based on how the team did that year.

[yon Beast]

Originally Posted by SiteWolf

... out of concern that active traders will blow by casual traders.

This is a concern that it's a concern....

active players deserve and should blow by those not as active...and those not as active should 'blow' by those that are not active.

This is my opinion, and I believe is only common sense.

[SiteWolf]

I'm concerned that you're concerned with my concern?
....maybe I'm overly concerned

What I mean is....even active players could potentially get 'left behind' more than they think...after years of viewing splits as something they just hold, suddenly those willing to buy and sell them daily can make significant gains on those who don't have or want to take the time.....one thing if you're talking 10k shares......10 times the effect when it's 100k shares.

For example, someone taking the time to sell losing goalies, buy winning goalies (which some have always done...just not with splits) won't take the negative hit when a goalie split loses....maybe even more an issue wouldn't take the negative hit on a golfer who has a bad day. Yes, that's always been true...just not with splits at 10 times the dollar value of max shares.

In other words, my concern has more to do with people who've been used to MANAGING their portfolio (adding new IPOs, maybe selling losing pitchers and goalies sometimes and buying them back) suddenly having to either trade more actively, or lose ground more quickly than ever before. And some of those managers are VERY active here...but they're managing their TV port while playing comp ports actively.

Maybe I'm overanalyzing...maybe I'm trying to save people from themselves

[rich76]

Originally Posted by da Beast

This is a concern that it's a concern....

active players deserve and should blow by those not as active...and those not as active should 'blow' by those that are not active.

This is my opinion, and I believe is only common sense.

and I agree 100%

[Being]

I find this very frustrating... without trying to "threaten" anything, I gotta say it just leaves me wondering why I bother...

I don't care whether we have splits, whether they are maxed at 100K, 1 Mil, 10 Mil, whether the split price is $100K. I'm also not crazy about all this excess cash AND how, because of it, guys $250 Billion behind me can still earn the same absolute amount as me in any year.

But what really gets me? This is a TRADING game. Of the 4 active sports, there are 806 stocks, 234 (29%) of which are splitters. Can you imagine?? 29% of the market doesn't move!!! 1 in 3. What kind of trading game is that?

Secondly, what was the criteria of the trial in order to determine success or failure???? I did a little work. Tracked the top 25 moo'ers daily for the first 25 days of Feb. How many splitters in those 625 stocks? NONE. How many DT50K? NONE. How many DT100K? 41!!!

Well, at least we got some trading...

Open it ALL THE WAY UP. Day trade ALL 275 splitters. Period. Let splits go to the millions. Still day trade 'em at any amount.

[yon Beast]

Originally Posted by SiteWolf

In other words, my concern has more to do with people who've been used to MANAGING their portfolio (adding new IPOs, maybe selling losing pitchers and goalies sometimes and buying them back) suddenly having to either trade more actively, or lose ground more quickly than ever before. And some of those managers are VERY active here...but they're managing their TV port while playing comp ports actively.

that would include me....and playing more is an option I would happily consider once the reins have been either checked or let out

Originally Posted by SiteWolf

Maybe I'm overanalyzing...

Yes!
You are quick to respond when prompted and are in on most conversations. Awesome!...but you can lose perspective.
Step back and look at the game....not like a newbie or one of us...but as you saw it ten years ago.

Originally Posted by Blackhawkaholic

If it's not broke dont fix it.

The argument being....splits.
Are they broken?...why?
Because they get to be worth a lot.



I've spent more time thinking about this than my retirement. The only solution I keep coming back to is to re-issue cheaper stock! (class B) let class 'A' go....but you must reduce the divi.

example

Class 'A splits @ 10:1
Class 'B' share automatically issued to the market for purchase upon Class 'A' split
Class 'B' is ipo'd @ $100.00 (hundred)
Once class 'B' shares are available after a split and they have their first divi (in %)....say 10% for ease...class 'B' dividend works out to be $10.00 per share.
THAT's the number should be paid class A...$10.00 a share...NOT 10% of the total value.

As I see it...this will fix all

[rrock33]

I can understand both sides.

I was one who held splits when we went to 50K trading.

Now that 100K trading of golf, goalies,and now nascar have evolved, I have moved on the TV leaderboard which renews my love for this game.

Idk, You can please some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

[bballjer44]

Originally Posted by SiteWolf

I'm concerned that you're concerned with my concern?
....maybe I'm overly concerned

What I mean is....even active players could potentially get 'left behind' more than they think...after years of viewing splits as something they just hold, suddenly those willing to buy and sell them daily can make significant gains on those who don't have or want to take the time.....one thing if you're talking 10k shares......10 times the effect when it's 100k shares.

For example, someone taking the time to sell losing goalies, buy winning goalies (which some have always done...just not with splits) won't take the negative hit when a goalie split loses....maybe even more an issue wouldn't take the negative hit on a golfer who has a bad day. Yes, that's always been true...just not with splits at 10 times the dollar value of max shares.

In other words, my concern has more to do with people who've been used to MANAGING their portfolio (adding new IPOs, maybe selling losing pitchers and goalies sometimes and buying them back) suddenly having to either trade more actively, or lose ground more quickly than ever before. And some of those managers are VERY active here...but they're managing their TV port while playing comp ports actively.

Maybe I'm overanalyzing...maybe I'm trying to save people from themselves

Or maybe you just need to give them a reason to be active in TV.

[SiteWolf]

I have no problem admitting I've spent way too much time analyzing this and far too much energy being concerned about situations that may not even exist. Long run, I think the 2 classes of stock idea can be worked in...but it'd take some programming. I haven't, however, thought thru how much...or whether it'd be something that could be put together fairly quickly.

I also have no problem whatsoever opening it all up in the meantime. The test period (I may not have said but was in my head) was with the idea programming for a long term solution could be done soon. Nick simply hasn't had time..in fact I haven't even had a chance to talk to him about it.

I can have every split on the market open for 100k daytrading in less time than it took me to type this post....so if that's what you guys want for now, it's not exactly hard for me to accomplish.

[disk7]

::POPS HEAD UP::

WAAAIT....What are we defining as an "Active user"...??

"Welcome, disk7.
You last visited: 26 Apr 2012 at 09:11 PM"

//In my absence...I'm designating Rich76 as my proxy vote, to use at his discretion, in all matters relating to gameplay. And to wack anyone with a 9 iron whenever he sees fit!


Goooooo Twwwiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnsssssssss!!!

::Sneaks away..::

[rich76]

Originally Posted by disk7

::POPS HEAD UP::

WAAAIT....What are we defining as an "Active user"...??

"Welcome, disk7.
You last visited: 26 Apr 2012 at 09:11 PM"

//In my absence...I'm designating Rich76 as my proxy vote, to use at his discretion, in all matters relating to gameplay. And to wack anyone with a 9 iron whenever he sees fit!


Goooooo Twwwiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnsssssssss!!!

::Sneaks away..::

[BlackDiamond]

Originally Posted by Blackhawkaholic

Why penalize those that have endured the ups & downs of holding splits???? If as was said in the beginning of the site that we are trying to mimic a 'Sports Stock Exchange' then let them ride, sports are not a level playing field, if someone joined last year, much like if i bought a stock, do they deserve the same benefits & immediate (when they have enough $$$ to own the same number of shares as someone who has been here for years?) ability to buy what it took me years to earn? Stop taking away the million plus shares, none of us need more cash, if i want to lose 18% OF 10 million shares worth, isnt that my perogative, just think of how much cash I would have lost when Mo Rivera went down to injury last spring on the sell off of his stock. If it's not broke dont fix it. Why penalize those of us who have been here long term & check in everyday but dont day trade??? I see the point in letting people day trade 100k but why not find other ways of SPENDING the $$$ you create in the sell off, that would liven up the markets instead of making more cash that we can never expect to spend, OR give us the option of keeping our millions of splits & reaping the + & - of holding onto them.

Agreed