OK...I've bit my tongue long enough

[rich76]

While I'd LOVE for Ken, Andrew and other libs to weigh in on this...as has been the case so far...I don't expect it. STILL can't figure out why. You guys ripped the shiznit out of every single thing you didn't like about Bush, McCain, Palin et all....yet you have nothing negative to say about our current jackass.

Here's what I feel so passionate about tonight...HEALTHCARE!!!

What have you Dems/Libs seen about ALL other govt run entities that lead you to believe that our govt is qualified to run healthcare?

Medicare? They're BROKE!
Medicaid? They're BROKE!
Amtrak? They're broke!
Social Security? They'll be broke real soon!
Fannie Mae? JOKE!
Freddie Mac? JOKE!

You guys (especially you Ken) talk about Constitution violations...exactly where in our constitution does it give our govt the authority or the power to regulate or run healthcare? It does NOT!

Obama is hellbent on getting this debacle through as I am QUITE sure that he is banking on this being his legacy.

I have said this more than once here....when he was elected, I was actually rooting for him to be successful...in getting this country and our economy back on track. Putting this much effort and tax dollars into getting healthcare through is the biggest mistake he EVER could have made and if it does NOT pass...the polls will reflect it in November and he can kiss a 2nd term goodbye...IMHO of course. Had he put as much $$$$ and effort into the economy - particularly JOBS - he'd be a TON better off than he is now.

What say ye?

[hork]

Originally Posted by rich76

While I'd LOVE for Ken, Andrew and other libs to weigh in on this...as has been the case so far...I don't expect it. STILL can't figure out why.

was explicitly asked to help maintain peace around here. and to refrain from engaging in any discussions that might be seen as antagonistic or may lead to discussions devolving into what amounts to playground trash talking in an attempt to keep newcomers from feeling as though the boards are too hostile an environment to post freely in.

at least in my case, that is the short answer to why i've refrained from posting on this board and in many of the threads in the jockstocks today forum.

that is not to suggest that i don't read such threads or should it in anyway be taken as an attempt by me to agree or disagree with any posted opinion. just figured i'd clear up the confusion as to why i've refrained from replying.

[Thunderbirds]

Rich,

There are two other items you missed in your lisitng. What about the 1/2 million new jobs that he was supposed ot have created in his first year? What about all of these czars that he has created without congressional approval.

[rich76]

Originally Posted by Thunderbirds

Rich,

There are two other items you missed in your lisitng. What about the 1/2 million new jobs that he was supposed ot have created in his first year? What about all of these czars that he has created without congressional approval.

I have actually mentioned the czars before:

http://forums.jockstocks.com/showthread.php?t=6570

I did mention jobs in my initial post in this thread as well.Pretty much the enitre last paragraph was about jobs.

Ken.....you mean to say that you cannot respond to a post here without being antagonistic or demeaning? I find that very difficult to understand.

[SiteWolf]

I do not, will not, and never want people to think I'm trying to put myself out there as ANY kind of knowledgeable on this. In MY case, I simply choose to remain somewhat uninformed because...well, I already take blood pressure pills as it is....

I will say I do understand Ken's situation to an extent, tho. After all, this forum has a decidedly 'right' feel lately...and your original post, Rich, was as well, yes?

That said, I've always thought political debates could be kept civil, but have seen over and over again (not just here) that, since the items being discussed get personal, so do the discussions. What disappoints me about these discussions, tho, is....why do they have to?

I would be lying if I didn't say I feel our boards here are quieter in part because this particular forum has had this exact issue....and that saddens me greatly. It saddens me even more that too many relationships here have been quashed by discussions here.

I would give my eye teeth to recover the forum activity we used to have. Rich, you know I have often said that the community was as much a part of why WSS worked as the game itself. Well, it's the same here- losing our community feel has most definitely effected overall site activity.

Anyway, enough on that...not meaning to hijack your thread...

so back to the discussion at hand....and just throwing something else out there...

Maybe I've just not seen or heard discussion about this part of things, but.....the largest single generation in US history has been paying taxes and into social security their entire adult lives...but are now reaching the age where they will be collecting, rather than paying in...as the so-called baby boomers are reaching retirement age. Where does ANY increase come from if there is a DEcrease in people it can come from?

[hork]

Originally Posted by rich76

Ken.....you mean to say that you cannot respond to a post here without being antagonistic or demeaning? I find that very difficult to understand.

not at all but if the past is any indication these threads have a tendency to devolve from intelligent discussion to stone throwing and name calling quicker than one can hit the submit button. so again, in an attempt to make the boards a friendlier place for new folks to post i agreed to refrain from engaging in potentially volatile discussions or those that have already reached that point (e.g., this one )

[rich76]

Ken/Orren......I can assure you...on my word and as sincere as I can be...I am having a hard time remembering any thread that went deep south without inducement from others either by their insulting some, demeaning some, or pretty much out and out implying that someone was a dumbass (maybe not in those exact words). We are all entitled to our opinions and feelings...whether right or wrong in anyone's eyes. Many attempts to try and make someone change those opinions or feelings have ended up in what you both have referred to. Ken.....if my statement was volatile to you ....then I apologize.

I can also say...WITH A CLEAR CONSCIENCE...that if ANY other president was forsaking job growth , the economy, or illegal aliens for healthcare...I would be posting the exact same thing. I am ALL for discussing things here.....what I AM against is the belittling and demeaning that has taken place. I agree 100% Orren....they should NOT get personal. I'd rather not...but could if need be...come up with many more of those situations coming from the Dems/Libs than anyone else. When that happens...people like me will "put 'em up" and defend myself. I'd have little if any respect for anyone that wouldn't.

I'm also having a hard time believing that other forums have been affected by this forum. I just don't see it. Enlighten me.

As far as WSS Orren.......I don't want to bring up old buried shiznit...but that community as you called it was sort of a farce no? Stock running...illegal shares in MANY ports etc.
Also there were significantly more members and thusly related to more posts.

[StockTrader]

An article worth the read: http://bit.ly/d8wCNk

It is about HC and the true savings that will take place. This is from the AP.

Nick

[rich76]

Originally Posted by StockTrader

An article worth the read: http://bit.ly/d8wCNk

It is about HC and the true savings that will take place. This is from the AP.

Nick

thanks for that NIck....business as usual...we get part of the truth...not the whole truth. No big deal though....politics as usual...for as long as I can remember.

[spoc22]

I remember ken telling me he appreciated the discussions that took place here, (at least between him and I) because they were so much more civil than others he was involved in on other sites.

[hork]

Originally Posted by spoc22

I remember ken telling me he appreciated the discussions that took place here, (at least between him and I) because they were so much more civil than others he was involved in on other sites.

i remember saying that too, and like i said then i don't have to agree with someone but can't help but respect them when their opinions are presented in a dignified and respectful fashion. an art that seems to have been lost of late.

[spoc22]

Probably because I haven't been around much

[rich76]

tel me your opinion on this one Ken..and I have more.....

My wife is 55 years old and without health insurance. It appears that due to a few things lately in personal situations we may be able to get her covered soon....BUT... it now appears with this debacle of reform that she will be charged a premium that includes maternity coverage and she has NO option to not have that coverage! That being said...if she chooses NOT to have any coverage she will be required to cough up 750.00 or 950.00 (can't remember) for that privilege.

WTF?

[oldstewball]

This tax bill is totally unconstitutional. The government has no right to tell us we must buy any product from a corporation. Doesn't matter if the product is good or bad for us. They simply don't have the right to force everyone to buy health insurance, or anything else.